Recommeded Mic for Recording

[Daniel Vorp]

Forumites, please tell me what microphone you would recommend for recording steel thru an amp.

Thank you.

Dan

[Greg Cutshaw]

Dan,

All of the sound files on my web site were recorded using an MSA Legend with a Shure SM-57 mic in front of a Fender Steel King amp. This includes all the files on the Tab pages as well as the Steel King/MSA Sounds page. My recording setup is listed on the home recording page. I have the Shure placed about 5" front the grill cloth centered on the speaker cone and on axis with it. The sound has been so clear and balanced that I haven't had to experiment too much with different placements. I also have a Sennheiser e309 that works well but I have only used it with lead guitar and a Fender hot Rod Deluxe.

My Web Site

Greg

[Mark van Allen]

Hi, Daniel, you'll get a lot of mileage out of experimenting with whatever you have. Tone and response changes with the distance from the amp, whether you're micing near the center of the cone or out by the edge, and angle of the mic. Generally a brighter, crisper and perhaps harsher sound near the center, many people like to mic a 15" Black Widow, for instance, near where the center cap meets the paper cone. Further out toward the edge will sound softer, I often like it with the mic at a slight angle pointing in toward the center from the outside of the cone.
Small variations can yeild large tonal differences, hence the experimenting.
As far a mic types, what do you have? A stock Shure SM-57 has a good punchy response, but with a midrange peak that may not suit your playing style. The SM-58 will be a bit softer.

Most engineers would probably use either a large-diaphram condenser, there are many kinds, and even the cheaper Chinese brands like SE and MXL can sound very good, or a Ribbon type, which have a softer, fuller sound. Though traditionally expensive, there are some decent cheaper ribbons around now, like those from Nady and Shinybox. You might try two mics at different distances, especially if the amp sounds good in the room, like a 57 or similar right up on the grill and a ribbon or condenser 6 or 8 feet back.

Another large component of the sound is in the microphone pre-amp,generally speaking a dedicated outboard preamp will give better results than the much cheaper preamps in a typical mixing board, with different brands bringing very different charactersitics to the table, from clean to very colored.

As usual, the better gear you can afford, the better the end result. You would be able to hear the difference between an SM-57 through a Mackie board, and a high-end Condenser through an Avalon, Great River, or similar preamp.

[Tony Prior]

Hi Dan, nice question which should generate some good responses.

Although I would never disagree that either a Shure SM57 or 58 will give a good response, I tend to agree with Mark in that a large diaphram condensor will give a smoother overall response, even a low cost one like an MXL. I have always found that the dynamics compared to the condensors can be a bit shrill especially in the mids. But the proof is always in the results. Greg states above that he uses a 57, his clips sound very good to me so perhaps that's as far as you need to go.

A year or two back we did a small Christmas project for our family here at the house so I purchased a low cost MXL 2000 Condensor mic and a low cost ART Tube Dual preamp , $200 for both, Those two items have become a mainstay in my home system. The ART Preamp is now used 100% of the time whether it be for practice thru my workstation or recording. A tube preamp ( even a low cost one ) at the front of a digital workstation will yield quality results over NO preamp whether you use a dynamic mic or a condensor mic. I am actually pondering the purchase of a high $$$ tube preamp , I believe it will be well worth the investment.

Mic placement around the amp speaker, regardless of which type of mic will probably yield the largest degree of sound and volume variation, so experiment and learn what works for you.

IF you intend to record at home often, having both a 57 and a Condensor is really the key. Having both options available allows for totally different sound color for different projects. The 57's run about $80 and a low cost large diaphram Condensor can be had for under $100, but it will require phantom power, so be sure your workstation or recorder has that feature.

By the way, every Musician should have an SM57 or 58 in there parts bag anyway....

good luck

tp

www.tprior.com

[Greg Cutshaw]

I agree with Tony about having multiple mics to try for every situation. The 57 seems to do a good job of ignoring ambient noise but lacks enough gain to run directly into my Yamaha AW1600. I run it into a $100 Yamaha MG10/2 mixer which has virtually inaudible white noise if you set the gains properly. The MXL-992 that came for free with the AW1600 is just awesome for accoustic guitar. I have not tried it for steel guitar but it is extremely sensitive so I have to make sure the room is pretty quiet when I record. Many of my recordings feature a Panasonic air conditioner, Hitachi TV and a Rheem furnace but you have to listen close to hear them.

Greg

[Ron Randall]

Mic's for recording steel?
Many wonderful tracks have been made with the SM57.
Another old favorite is the Sennheiser 421?. Not sure of the number but it is also a dynamic mic. just the right sound thru a tube preamp.

Placement of the mic should be about midway between the rim of the speaker and the edge of the center dome. Closer to the outer edge, more bassy. About a half inch from the grill cloth. If the amp is open back, look out for unwanted sounds sneaking through.

For a great recording, you need a great preamp for any mic. A mic and preamp go together kinda like a guitar and amp. Experiment. That is the fun part.

[Scott Appleton]

I have great results with the least expensive Rode
Mic I belive is a N1 .. It was the first large diaphram
inexpensive mike they made .. great in front of an amp
about 4 or 5 inches from the grill.

[Tony Prior]

Gregs comment cracked me up..and he is dead right..

If you are using a large Diaphram Condensor you may have to call your neighbors and tell them to turn down there TV set !

I hear things in the Phones with the Condensor that I cannot hear when the Phones are not on...

Creeky Floors, Bathrooms, Water running ,Cats Meowing ,all sorts of stuff....

I guess thats why the real guys have REAL studio's !

tp

[Jay Ganz]

Oh...I don't know. Sometimes a toilet flush in the
backround can do wonders on certain tracks.

[Jonathan Shacklock]

Interesting thread on this site about lesser known alternatives to the 'standard' dynamic mics. You can often get these things much cheaper than the more well known names and many of them have exactly the same components inside.

I have a Shure Unidyne PE54, essentially a 545S, that is just as good as an SM57 but cost half as much (and doubles up as a great harp mic). I recently got hold of one of the Uher M537's mentioned in the link above which is supposed to sound like a Sennheiser 421. I don't know about that. It's a little bit hissy but I think it will make a great mic for recording steel, capturing those highs. I'll have to experiment with it more before giving it a full recommendation. The point is, cheap mics can be good mics if you do a bit of research.

[Daniel Vorp]

Thanks to all for your responses.

Dan

[John Macy]

Don't forget ribbon mics...

There is a whole new generation of ribbons priced very well these days, the Shiny Box (www.shinybox.com) 46 series being my faves. They are often chosen over my Royer ribbons which cost 4 times as much...

Then again, the Sennheiser 421 is a favorite for me--very seldom use a 57, though it works very well. Experiment with what you have laying around--you might be surprised...

[Darrell Owens]

Royer R-122 with a Martech preamp.