Let's Be Realistic About a Steel Guitar HOF Building

Louie Hallford · Post by **Louie Hallford** » 8 Sep 2001 10:59 am

I haven't stirred any crap up lately so here goes.

For a small group of people that can't even support a Steel Guitar magazine and keep it in business,do we really think there is going to be a HOF building built even at "just the cost of a few $100,000" ,not even considering the operating cost of utilities,maintenance and labor to keep it open 6 days a week.( maybe I missed it if someone voluntered to donate their time 6 days a week to run it.Even if they did volunteer, I'll believe that when I see it.)

Who is going to go see it except a small percentage of a few thousand steel guitar players in the world.I ask my next door neighbor if he would support it. He is retired and hasn't even made it to the baseball and football hall of fame yet... well me neither.He didn't seem too interested.

The whole idea borders on being a hoax ,to be polite.If not that,it is even worse,it would a big time waste of money.

Yes ,I will continue to support the HOF to the tune of helping purchase some brass placques for the honerees,put please don't put my name on the list of believers that expect to see this great building constructed that maybe 20,000 people in the world have the least bit of interest in.
Better things can be done with the money even if if is a feasible endeavor.

I would buy into a small cubby hole for the SGHOF somewhere in the Country Music museum in Nashville if we could pull it off.

If we are really serious about keeping the legacy alive,how about more projects, like the one some in our ranks are involved with in making guitars available for some of the younger and under priviledged generation who might play steel if they could afford the cost. There is at least one project such as this happening now .

message was edited by louie hallford on 08 September 2001 at 12:12 PM.][This message was edited by louie hallford on 08 September 2001 at 12:16 PM.]

Jim Cohen · Post by **Jim Cohen** » 8 Sep 2001 12:07 pm

I like your suggestion at the end, there Louie. Here's another: an emergency medical fund for members of the Hall of Fame. Or a pension-type fund? Just brainstorming...

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 8 Sep 2001 2:35 pm

Louie, I think you're right about a Steel Guitar "Hall of Fame" building. There would never be enough support to keep it going. Starting one, and then having it fail, would be worse than never having one at all. Scratch that.

As far as manufacturers "giving away" steels to underpriviliged children, I can't even go along with that. Sooner or later, the kid might trash it, or sell it, or just lose interest. And sooner or later, you'd have two deserving kids...and only one steel. WHO would make the decision as to who gets it? What would be the basis? IMHO, I'd say forget that, too. You'd probably make as many enemies as you would future steelplayers. Anyone who wants to learn to play steel can buy a decent used lap steel for about the same (or maybe cheaper) than a regular guitar. Then, if they have the desire, and the talent, they'll find a way to get a better one...maybe a pedal job.

Emergency medical fund? Pension fund? Jim, you must be kidding! A benevolent fund for "needy steelers" sounds good...but once again...who would even donate? I must say that steelplayers are certainly not the most "money-generous" group I've ever run into!

(Sorry if that hurts...but it's true.) Who would administrate, and who would get the money? As for myself, I prefer not to have some "commitee" say where my money goes. I'll make my own donations, and everyone else here could do the same. But too often...they just don't.

If we could ever get a small room in the Country Music HOF, that might just have to do. That's the only practical suggestion I see here.

Jack Stoner · Post by **Jack Stoner** » 8 Sep 2001 2:46 pm

I don't ever expect a Steel guitar HOF building will ever be built too. We can dream about it but at the rate they are going it is unlikely that it will ever come about.

But, I don't like the idea of getting space in the Country Music HOF either. If they provided space they would ultimately want to take it over and decide who gets to be nominated/inducted.

Everything that has been done so far has been done with good intentions (there may be some that disagree) however, having the HOF plaques in the basement of a Hotel in St Louis somehow just doesn't seem right.

bob drawbaugh · Post by **bob drawbaugh** » 8 Sep 2001 3:02 pm

Louie, I'm with you there will never be a HOF building.

Donny, I'm with you. Who would I trust my money with. Not The HOF commtee. From what I can see it has become way to political.

The Country Music Hall Of Fame takeing over the ISGHF. Now that may not be such a bad ideal. At least it would remove some ISGHF commitee members that have become to political.[This message was edited by bob drawbaugh on 08 September 2001 at 04:03 PM.][This message was edited by bob drawbaugh on 08 September 2001 at 04:40 PM.]

Bobbe Seymour · Post by **Bobbe Seymour** » 8 Sep 2001 5:46 pm

Donny Hinson-----Why are you ALWAWS right?
You really are. I'll talk to the C. M. Hall of fame again, as in, I already have once. They said they hadn't heard of but about five people that are in it! I've been in country music about half a century, and there are several I havent heard of so I kind of understand where they are coming from. Hall of fame? I think they want the folks in it to be famous.Don't get mad at me now, this is what the powers that be told me six months ago. I'll try again if i'm asked to do so by the SGHF board, who knows, It might happen!
Bobbe
Bobbe

Louie Hallford · Post by **Louie Hallford** » 8 Sep 2001 7:22 pm

Donny,Please note that I did not suggest that manufacturers give guitars away. They would probably soon be out of business with such a program.

Some one posted recently of used guitars being made available to aspiring young players who would either learns to play or they would return the guitar for it to be passed on to someone else.As I don't know the whole story I won't venture any further , except to say I think it involved a program that some of the Dominion Gospel players along with others had promoted. I just thought it was a good idea and could possibly be expanded if worked.

Yor points about what might happen too the guitars is very valid,especially if there is not responsible management.

Dan Dowd · Post by **Dan Dowd** » 9 Sep 2001 4:35 am

Maybe some of the money could be used to produce a good video tape of the players who are imortalized. I think that would be more usefull and I could have my own Hall of Fame with these videos and visit them every day if I wanted. There are many people who have not made the St Louis show, let alone have the time and resourses to travel to a building someplace in the country to see what. I would rather see a great video of Curly, Bobby,Jimmy,Speedy, and all the other great pickers before they are gone. The steel comunity is getting smaller every year and with not many younger players coming to our ranks, who would be left to visit the hall of fame. IMHO the money would be better spent on "The Great Masters Video Collection".

Joe Casey · Post by **Joe Casey** » 9 Sep 2001 6:18 am

I don't want to insult anyone but the whole Idea of a Steel Guitar Hall of Fame (a seperate building) for Steel guitarist is totally a pipe dream. First of all who are the Steel guitarist whose fame has risen to a level that they are a household word? True most of us musicians (country)know who the greats of the instrument are ,however john Q public and mr and mrs.country fan can name the singing artist but the musicians unless they get the performance showcase of a chet Atkins,Les Paul,Roy Clark to name a few don't recieve enough public support to be consided Famous.I repeat we as lifelong musicians know who the greats are because they set the standards we all try to achieve and more. Fame is a four letter word that isn't offensive but it is earned by so few even so it is deserved by many. I would like to see the Pedal Steel accepted in the high regard of all the other musical Instruments and its deserving players added to a total Musicians Hall of fame.

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CJC

[This message was edited by Joe Casey on 09 September 2001 at 07:23 AM.]

Larry Bell · Post by **Larry Bell** » 9 Sep 2001 7:37 am

Is there even a (Spanish) guitar hall of fame? I'm not aware of one. I know there's a Blues HOF, but that's more like the Country Music HOF. With hundreds of guitarists for every steel player, it's interesting that steel players find the HOF idea so intriguing and guitarists apparently don't. Wonder why.

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Larry Bell - email: larry@larrybell.org - gigs - Home Page
2000 Fessenden S-12 8x8, 1969 Emmons S-12 6x6, 1971 Emmons D-10 9x9, 1971 Dobro

Tom Bradshaw · Post by **Tom Bradshaw** » 9 Sep 2001 12:04 pm

The idea for a "museum" or a building to house steel guitar memorabilia came from a lot of people, and it originated years before the Hall of Fame came into existence. There is nothing wrong with such an idea. Its becoming a reality does seem far fetched to me. However, various people have voiced support for such a museum or a Hall of Fame building. Many of those people have donated guitars and other items of interest to Scotty. It would not be right for Scotty to refuse their donations or rebuff their desire to contribute to a cause that definitely has historical implications. However, Scotty has virtually run out of room in the basement of his house and his music store because of these regular gifts for inclusion in such a building.

Over the years, Scotty has also received several offers from well-healed individual who have stated that upon their deaths, they want to donate the funds to create such a museum. Those people definitely have the wealth to bestow a gift to the non-profit corporation that was actually formed to accept such gifts (and obviously, they are not working steel players; they are just people who love the instrument and made their money elsewhere). Scotty has asked these benefactors to put their gifting intentions in writing, and in their wills. It is not known if these people will follow through on their voiced intentions.

With this history, what should Scotty do? He didn't solicit these offers. I don't believe Scotty should rebuff them. Will these people follow through? Who knows? However, to discount those statements would be to insult a person who voices a desire to document a lot of the instrument's past and that of its players.
Will it ever happen? Probably not, but it just might. Who knows?

If your aspirations remain grounded, they will definitely never reach the stars.

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 9 Sep 2001 12:17 pm

There is a big bowling Hall OF Fame building already in downtown St. Louis. Why not a modest steel guitar HOF building ?

It would be a nice thing if it happened.

Bob

Craig A Davidson · Post by **Craig A Davidson** » 9 Sep 2001 12:29 pm

We have a program that's connected to the Northeast Iowas Steel Guitar Jam. We call it the jump-start program. We pick someone who would be interested in playing steel, and give them the use of one, plus lessons for a year. After that year they have the option of buying the guitar they have or giving it back and getting something else. We figure this way, to start the expense of buying a guitar to start is eased a bit. We know that not everyone we pick will stick with it, but, we hope one or two will pick up the ball and run with it.

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1985 Emmons push-pull, Session 500, Nashville400, 65 re-issue Fender Twin, Fender Tele

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 9 Sep 2001 3:36 pm

I don't see why it has to be a wholey owned building. Just a rented storefront in St. Louis could establish a physical presence.

I'd be opposed to connecting it to the Country Music HOF. To do so would imply that the steel guitar was only a country instrument. Steel transcends musical and cultural boundaries - the CMHOF does not.

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<img align=right src="http://b0b.com/b0b.gif" width="64" height="64">Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (E7, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (F Diatonic)
Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6)

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 9 Sep 2001 6:34 pm

Bobby, I don't think most people think of steel only as a country instrument, but they do think of it mainly as a country instrument. And, if you really think about it, there's a good reason for this. The vast majority of support for the instrument comes from the field of country music. For over 50 years, everyone from Alvino Rey to Sneaky Pete have tried to make it an "accepted" instrument in other forms of music. For a time, there's a brief flicker of general interest, and then it fades away...retreating back to the only place it has maintained popularity...in country music.

IMHO, it's not the stubborn "too countrified players" that keep it there, but rather the will of the general public. The steel, especially today's version; replete with more strings, tunings, and pedals than most people care to think about, is just a little too "off the wall" to find general popularity. The expense of the thing, the complexity, the difficulty to really master it (as even B.E. has admitted), and the lack of standardization, is what dooms the instrument to permanent obscurity...not its connection to "country music".

Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 9 Sep 2001 9:48 pm

Doomed to permanent obscurity? Geez, I hope not, Donny.

You mentioned Alvino Rey, a bandleader who was never known for country recordings. Alvino Rey is on the SGHOF. Other inductees include Hawaiian master Sol Hoopii and jazz great Joaquin Murphey. The future SGHOF might well include players like B J Cole and Chuck Campbell whose artistry rarely touches the country genre at all.

Don't get me wrong - I love country music and I love country steel guitar. I've spent most of my life playing country steel. While it's true that steel is, as you say, mainly a country instrument, I hear it in all kinds of music today.

There's no telling what the future will bring. A hundred years from now, people will look at the SGHOF as a historical record of how the instrument evolved. They might wonder about country music, and why so many early pioneers of the instrument were country musicians. To their ears, it might not sound "country" at all. Who knows?

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<img align=right src="http://b0b.com/b0b.gif" width="64" height="64">Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (E7, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (F Diatonic)
Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6)

Mark Cohen · Post by **Mark Cohen** » 9 Sep 2001 10:23 pm

Of course, there is always the possibility that Scotty would want to devote some wall space to plaques that the Steel Playing community pays for. I can't help but believe that one of them would have his name on it.

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Mark Cohen

Dan Dowd · Post by **Dan Dowd** » 10 Sep 2001 4:41 am

I wonder how many folks would travel to wherever the Hall or place is to view artifacts relating to the steel guitar. How would this hallowed place be maintained without a large attendance. While I think it is a great idea with great intentions,it is unlikely to be a drawing card for the general public. Where would the revenue for operating expenses come from. I read elsewhere on the forum the attendance at the ISGC this year was around 4200. If all these folks paid $3.00 to see the Hall of fame thats not enough to pay the expenses. Also would these folks go there every year. I have been to the Football Hall of Fame once, and probably not go back in my lifetime. Once the current population of steel players are gone, where will the new ones come from. I didnt see many young faces at the convention this year. I think this Hall of Fame idea need to be given a lot more thought. Having funding to build a building is just the tip of the iceburg. [This message was edited by Dan Dowd on 10 September 2001 at 08:20 AM.]

Carl West · Post by **Carl West** » 10 Sep 2001 5:08 am

Joe Casey . . . Well stated and very true.

Carl West

Jim Smith · Post by **Jim Smith** » 10 Sep 2001 5:46 am

I read elsewhere on the forum the attendance at the ISGC this year was around 42,000.

You must have meant to say 4,200, right?

Dan Dowd · Post by **Dan Dowd** » 10 Sep 2001 7:21 am

Wishful thinking, thanks for finding that error. I corrected it on my post.

Jack Stoner · Post by **Jack Stoner** » 10 Sep 2001 7:39 am

Here's another thought. I think it's safe to assume that most agree a HOF "building" is never going to be built.

Why not take an freight box (18 wheeler freight trailer) and convert it into a HOF "museum". It could then be taken to various events around the country. Charge a nominal admission to at least cover expenses.
I don't know how practical this idea is, but it's something to think about.

Fred Murphy · Post by **Fred Murphy** » 10 Sep 2001 12:15 pm

Scotty has not asked for any ideas, so he may not want any, but I think the best bet would be to try to rent a small,pemanent amount of space from the Country Music Hall of Fame. Maybe enough money can be raised for an endowment to pay for the space. I think it would be the best location possible, if the CMHOF would be willing to do it.

Dave Van Allen · Post by **Dave Van Allen** » 10 Sep 2001 1:22 pm

as far as memorabelia and donated items, has anyone considered contacting the Smithsonian?

Steel Guitar is just enough of a unique and of American origin instrument that perhaps some interest might be genrated along those lines...

$.02

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 10 Sep 2001 1:55 pm

Dave, the only bad thing about donating to the Smith's is that they only keep the really popular stuff on permanent display. Last time I toured the place, they said only 5% of their "holdings" are on display at any one time. That means that you might see something there this year, and then you might not see it again for another 10 years! Most of the time, stuff is stuck away in their many, many warehouses...waiting for space and demand. I felt the same when the Library of Congress approached Leon Kagarise, and asked him for his 5,000 hours of '50s and '60s country and bluegrass music tapes. It might wind up unaccessable for most of us living right now. No, to have a display, it should be available so you could see it anytime. That lets the big institutions out, as far as I'm concerned. I'm care about the near (next 20 years) future of the steel guitar, and not the distant (100 years, hence) legacies which historians, and not most musicians, care about.

Just my opinion...your mileage may vary...

[This message was edited by Donny Hinson on 10 September 2001 at 03:08 PM.]