Western Swing Steel players

Rich Young · Post by **Rich Young** » 20 Jun 2000 9:41 am

I've been playing steel now about 2 years. I've learned some of the Hank Williams stuff and the Bob Wills stuff (well, kinda learned

.
Who should I look at next? I'd like some nonpedal playing so I can steal licks. I already have some Joaquin Murphey (a little over my head, at least on steel). I know there are a lot of good players out there, any suggestions on particular albums that would be good for learning stuff off?
Thanks.

Smiley Roberts · Post by **Smiley Roberts** » 20 Jun 2000 10:43 am

Try listening to some Leon McAullife stuff.
He was great,but not quite as technical as Joaquin Murphey.

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Bill Leff · Post by **Bill Leff** » 20 Jun 2000 11:52 am

Hey Rich, when you figure it out, come and teach me, ok?

Besides the notes, one of my problems is getting that old time sound. I have a D8
Stringmaster (60's vintage) and it sounds a lot thinner to my ears than those great old Western recordings.

-Bill

Chris Walke · Post by **Chris Walke** » 20 Jun 2000 12:13 pm

Rich, have you heard jeremy wakefield yet? I highly recommend "Hot Guitars of Biller & Wakefield." It is certainly western swing/hawaiian inspired, but not limited to the style. It just may knock you out.

Also, Cindy Cashdollar, of Asleep at the Wheel, is a fine player. Pick up "Ride with Bob."

Mark van Allen · Post by **Mark van Allen** » 20 Jun 2000 12:29 pm

Rich, Here's a great one: Jimmie Rivers and the Cherokees "Bisbane Bop" Jr2501 on Joaquin Records. Live club stuff from S. Cal. in the early 60's, featuring Vance Terry on non-pedal in his heyday. He may make you as crazy as Joaquin- what a hot dog. And any of the Tom Morrell and the Time Warp Tophands stuff is incredible- "Wolf Tracks" is in even the big chain stores. Good luck with the licks, even those scary Joaquinisms may give you some good ideas if you bite off a little at a time.

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Mark van Allen-"Blueground Undergrass" Pedal, Non-Pedal, Lap, and Dobro

Rich Young · Post by **Rich Young** » 20 Jun 2000 12:35 pm

Thanks for the suggestions.
I have listened to all of the above. Steel gtr rag is the first song I ever learned on the steel. And I've been a huge Asleep at the Wheel since they're first (I think it was the first) album.
I havent' heard the Wakefield/Biller album, but I do have that Wayne Hancock album they played on and I've grabbed a few of those licks. Man, he's good!!! The whole band is real good.
I was driving through Houston a couple of weeks ago, on a saturday, and there was this radio station (left side of the dial, of course) that was playing all this great swing stuff, with ripping steel solos and parts. That's the kind of stuff that I'm looking for. Old recordings mostly.
I've got some Tex Williams, Spade Cooley and Bob Wills stuff here.
Any other ideas?
Thanks

Rich Young · Post by **Rich Young** » 20 Jun 2000 12:40 pm

Thanks Mark, that's the kind of stuff I'm looking for, the stuff that may be a little more obscure. I've heard of Morrell but haven't heard him yet. The others are new to me.
I was writing my first reply before you posted, that's why it came after your post.
Thanks for the tips.

Dave Zirbel · Post by **Dave Zirbel** » 20 Jun 2000 1:03 pm

Mark, I think Vance used a pedal steel on Brisbane Bop. He has a Wright Custom D-11 (I think) with 19 pedals! I talked with some pickers that know him and they confirmed this because I wondered if it was non-pedal or pedal when I first heard the record. It sounds like he uses bar movement to play his licks as opposed to using the pedals like in the modern style playing. He plays great non pedal on the Billy Jack Wills compilation also on Jaoquin Records. It is made up of various radio broadcasts in the early 1950's.

Dave Z

Mark Herrick · Post by **Mark Herrick** » 20 Jun 2000 1:29 pm

Definately pick up any of the Tom Morrell "How The West Was Swung" CD's. Many great takes on some of the classic Western Swing tunes done by a true master and his stable of heavy hitter swing "animals"! (The label art and notes are worth the admission!) You can usually find them at Tower, HMV, etc.

Check out website:
http://www.westernswing.net/

Troy Cody · Post by **Troy Cody** » 20 Jun 2000 2:11 pm

DON'T FORGET! Little Roy Wiggens.

HowardR · Post by **HowardR** » 20 Jun 2000 2:55 pm

Rich,if you haven't yet,check out the playing of Bob Dunn.He was the steel player
(an electrified acoustic)for Milton Brown and His Musical Brownies during the forties.Dunn was a pioneer of steel guitar who had a jazzier side.He originally was a trombone player and his horn phrasing translated into steel playing using a lot of single note technique.Great stuff!

Adam · Post by **Adam** » 20 Jun 2000 5:56 pm

You can't beat the recordings of Big Sandy and his Fly-Rite Boys on Hightone records for great steel playing.Their records feature plenty of steelman Lee Jeffries playing a vintage Bigsby..They are playing Western Swing in the style of the early fifties small groups.

Terry Wood · Post by **Terry Wood** » 21 Jun 2000 5:52 am

Hey Rich,

I would recommend that you get some of Hank Thompson's recordings. There is a lot of great Western Swing steel work on his recordings. The singing and all the other playing is great too.

Depending on the Hank era/recordings you listen to, it could be one of several great steel players on the recordings. Some of the steel players who worked with or recorded with Hank include: Bob White, Pee Wee Whitewing, Curly Chalker, Bert Rivera, Buddy Emmons and a bunch more.

The reason for so many is because Hank's career has lasted so long. This entertainer/star, and he is a star in the real sense, a class act and a super nice person, has recorded a ton of great Country and Western Swing songs and you won't be disappointed.

There are videos out on him too. I purchased a couple of those four or five years ago and Buddy Emmons, Bob White among other steel players are on them, but they were so good that when my brother borrowed them, he forgot to return them.

Again, I recommend the Hank Thompson recordings. Hope this might heklp you in some way.

God bless you,

Terry J. Wood

Ricky Davis · Post by **Ricky Davis** » 21 Jun 2000 12:29 pm

Hey Rich that Terry Wood nailed it pal. Curly Chalker was doing stuff on the non-pedal steel that still hasn't been played today; It is awsome and was obvious Curly was way beyond the times. I have the CD with all that on it and next time you come over for a lesson, I'll let ya borrow it pal. I think I may have some more stuff I haven't thought about too. Oh and anything Bob White played on too. I can't think right now can someone remind me where to find anything Bob White played on.
Of Course my all time favorite has to be Tommy Morrell of course and the tunings he uses are the ones you want to use anyways>"they make more since"as he says it.
Ricky

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Ricky Davis
http://hometown.aol.com/sshawaiian/RickyHomepage.html
http://users.interlinks.net/rebel/steel/steel.html
sshawaiian@aol.com

[This message was edited by Ricky Davis on 21 June 2000 at 01:35 PM.]

George Keoki Lake · Post by **George Keoki Lake** » 21 Jun 2000 6:38 pm

This won't answer your question, but it does pertain to Western Swing. I belong to a neat club called the Western Swing Music Society which is run by John York. John puts out a very interesting newsletter about 4 times a year...membership only (Cdn)$10.00 per year.
Write John, if interested, at 3565 Cambridge St., Vancouver, B.C. (Canada) V5K-1M3. By the way, $10.00 (Cdn) equates to roughly $7.00 US...bargain !
[This message was edited by George Keoki Lake on 21 June 2000 at 07:40 PM.]

Rich Young · Post by **Rich Young** » 21 Jun 2000 8:52 pm

Hey, thanks everybody. There’s some great suggestions here. Some I knew, but a whole lot I didn’t.
I checked out some of the Tommy Morrell stuff on Amazon.com. There’s some realaudio files. There wasn’t a lot of steel on the little clips, but what I heard sounded great. And the band sounded great, too. Mark, any CD in particular you’d recommend? There must have been 10 “how the west was swung” collections.

Adam, I should have thought of Big Sandy, I’ve heard their stuff before, I just forgot. I remember thinking “this stuff is cool!”. Completely slipped my mind.

Troy, I’ve heard a lot of good stuff about Roy Wiggens. Didn’t he play with Eddy Arnold for a while? What would you recommend that he played on?

Terry, yea I should have thought about Hank Thompson. 6 pack to go is one of my favorite songs. I know my brother has a bunch of his stuff, I’m going to email him and have him make me a tape. He owes me a Christmas present anyway!

Ricky, how ya doing? Can’t wait to see you on the Opry. Yea, we got to get together when you get back. Rest up for a couple of days first, though!! I have to give you back your Bob Wills CD. And you got to see my new steel, I really like it a lot. Any stuff you think I should listen to, I’m very open. If it makes me play half as good as you, I’ll take it!!!!
Howard, yea my brother also has some Milton Brown stuff. I remember liking it a lot, last time I heard it (which would be about 20 years ago, I’m afraid). Didn’t Leon McCallife play with Milton Brown for a while before Bob Wills. I seem to remember something like that.
By the way, I was in Walmart today waiting while my girlfriend was buying “girl” stuff and went into the CD dept. I got the “Ride With Bob” album and an Ernest Tubb collection. Both pretty cheap. So I got enough to get me through the weekend.  There’s a neat picture of the band on the back of the Tubb album, with a Fender Custom up against the chair. And a picture inside on the Opry with a guy playing what looks like it might be a Rick on a metal stand.

Again, thanks everyone. I’m saving this page for reference.

Andy Volk · Post by **Andy Volk** » 23 Jun 2000 4:07 pm

Okay ... here's the list:

- Tom Morrell: "Wolf Tracks" & Pterydactyl
PTales Volume 4 (with Clint Strong)
- Bob Wills "The Tiffany Transcriptions":
look for Noel Boggs & Herb Remington
in the personnel listing
- Tex Willams "On the Air" and "Spadella"
with Joaquin Murphy
- "Billy Jack Wills & his Western Swing Band"
with Vance Terry
- Milton Brown and his musical Brownies -
anything with Bob Dunn
- More great players to investigate:
Bobby Koeffer, Les Anderson, Roy Honeycutt

Mark Herrick · Post by **Mark Herrick** » 23 Jun 2000 8:18 pm

I've got 4 of the "How The West Was Swung" CD's and I'm kinda partial to "Smoke A Little Of This!" (Vol. 6)

I also have "Son of No Peddlers Allowed" (Vol. 9) Featuring Jerry Byrd, Bob White, "Pee Wee" Whitewing and Billy Braddy in addition to Tommy Morrell. (5 steel players for the price of one!) And "No Peddlers Allowed!" (Vol. 7) with Bob White, Herb Remington, John Ely, Bobby Koefer and Tom Morrell. (Another 5!)

wayne yakes md · Post by **wayne yakes md** » 27 Jun 2000 9:20 am

Terry,
I think you mean Bobby Garrett, not Buddy Emmons that played with Hank Thompson and the Brazos Valley Boys in that era. Emmons did record a CD with Hank in the 1990's, but that is his only contact.
I also would recommend the 1997 CD "Hank Thompson and Friends". This is the last thing Garrett ever recorded and what he did on C6th is mind boggling. NOBODY but Garrett played C6th like that! Vince Gill(who cut "One Six Pack To Go" with Hank on that CD) had to go up to Garrett and tell him how impressed he was with his playing.
With regard to Western Swing music, the Brazos Valley Boys for 12 years captured the "Best Western Swing Band" award encompassing Chalker, Whitewing, White, Garrett, and Rivera's years!

wayne yakes md · Post by **wayne yakes md** » 27 Jun 2000 9:26 am

I also recommend a couple Bob Will's albums on the Liberty label when Tommy Duncan finally came back to the Texas Playboys in the late 1950's-early 60's. Gene Crownover on steel does some of the best work he has ever done on these as well as the Johnny Lee Wills "Reunion" album of the late 1970's. Truly masterful western string.

Steve England · Post by **Steve England** » 28 Jun 2000 7:39 am

What those guys all said. The second and third volume of How the West was Swung Lets Ride With Tom and Bobby, and Lets Take Another Ride, are worth checking out, simply because they are one fo the few places you will get to hear recordings of Bobby Koefer. They were just cassette tapes originally, but I think the two albums are now on one CD. Also Billy Jack Will's two CDs on Joachim, both featuring Vance Terry on non pedal sttel are well worth checking.

Rich Young · Post by **Rich Young** » 28 Jun 2000 8:10 am

Thanks again everybody. I definatly have some record buying to do!

Terry Wood · Post by **Terry Wood** » 29 Jun 2000 4:36 pm

Hi Wayne,

Yes, Bobby Garret played with Hank, but what I am referring to is a video made in Nashville this past decade 1990s.

Terry Wood

Terry Wood · Post by **Terry Wood** » 29 Jun 2000 4:39 pm

Hi Again,

For all you Emmonites, yes, Buddy Emmons is one of the steel players that is featured on that video with Hank Thompson.

My brother has that video and everytime I see something on this forum, I think about and keep telling myself that I need to go and borrow it back.

T.J. Wood

Joel Glassman · Post by **Joel Glassman** » 3 Jul 2000 8:28 am

A couple of other suggestions: the following
players are pretty close to the Western Swing
sound--
Speedy West with Jimmy Bryant on the Razor and Tie Reissues--also
Buddy Charleton's Steel Guitar Club recording
(I believe its called Almost to Tulsa)
Buddy's playing on that recording is especially good. --Joel
You're getting into some great music here--I love the sound of swing steel...