Newbie home studio questions

gary pierce · Post by **gary pierce** » 11 Dec 2008 10:57 am

Any suggestions on software, interface, soundcard.
I'm getting a Qaud core duo 2.6 with 3 gigddr2, and running XP pro. I have heard Cubase and Nuendo are good, but alot of people run Pro Tools which is more expensive. This is just to record mostly accoustic, and steel of course.
Thanks, Gary

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 11 Dec 2008 3:05 pm

I had a cheap version of CubaseLE, it came free with the Tascam USB-144 Interface. They should have paid me to take the Cubase. I am now using Cakewalk Sonar 7 Home StudioXL, it's fine, easy to use, intuitive. It does not have everything the PRO Sonar packages have but compared to Cubase, it's very easy to use, it makes sense. Cubase made no sense to me. Maybe it was the LE version, I dunno...

I have used early versions of Cakewalk, then used dedicated workstations for the past many years and now have merged back to the PC platform which is really quite good if you have a dedicated PC and it is away from your normal daily pc activity .

Buy a nice package, spend the money ,you will not be sorry.

gary pierce · Post by **gary pierce** » 12 Dec 2008 5:18 am

Thanks for the input Tony. I should be through building my room in a couple of weeks, so I'll have time to shop around.

Ron ! · Post by **Ron !** » 12 Dec 2008 10:27 am

Gary,

Tony is right.That version of CubaseLE must be the worst I've ever seen.
Ha...if you have an old fashioned computer mouse you really have a blast with that piece of software.

I am using the same interface and must say that I have a good time with it with either Pro-Tools and/or Cool Edit.
Cool Edit is my personal fav....although many people ask me why I still work with it.

That Tascam US144 is a nifty little interface for a couple bucks.
I payed $150 for it I think.

Ron

Michael McGee · Post by **Michael McGee** » 12 Dec 2008 11:40 am

Gary, I urge you to give serious consideration to Reaper for doing multitrack recording.

http://www.reaper.fm/

Ron, cool edit is still my favorite editing/mastering software. I never like the way he designed the multi-track part...

Bill Terry · Post by **Bill Terry** » 12 Dec 2008 12:04 pm

Another vote for Reaper.. You should at least give it a try, you can download a fully functional version free..

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 13 Dec 2008 7:31 am

As Ron mentions, the little Tascam USB-144 is a very kool tool indeed. Two analog inputs,( 1/4 inch and Lo Z) one can be Hi Z for Guitar, both inputs have phantom power for mics, midi in, out and thru, RCA line out, phones out, mixing knobs etc, lots of stuff for a small inexpensive unit . When I first attempted to link this with the supplied Cubase software, it was a mess , it took forever, Cubase did not actually recognize it right away.That was the first indication of crummy software.

When I loaded Sonar, it found the USB-144 Interface and configured it before I even knew it was done ! When I went to use it for the 1st time, all was well. No issues at all. Like it should be. Each Sonar track has each input listed so you can select them as needed. A no brainer.

The USB-144 may not be the top of the line but is sure works well and fills the need for a small home midi studio where you want to plug in a guitar or mic now and then.

tp

gary pierce · Post by **gary pierce** » 19 Dec 2008 5:18 am

Thanks again for all the advice. I'm hearing alot of good feedback on Sonar, and I will also check our Reaper.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 2 Jan 2009 5:25 am

Gary, just remember, and I am not dissing the free shareware, free means free, you get what you pay for. I downloaded Reaper and it is indeed a product that works, but it is not a complete product. Thats why it is free.

Personally I think spending the $450 or so for Sonar 8 Producer is the answer along with an Interface such as the M Audio Delta 10/10 or a similar priced interface such as the Tascam. The biggest concern will be the latency issues. ( recording thru the software/PC with no audio delay ) The Tascam is fine ( just makes it ) but I have read excellent reviews regarding the M Audio.

Yes you can monitor the input with no delay issues, but you will not be able to use any of the software features, effects, Eq's etc while recording. Recording thru the PC means you are monitoring the input signal at the other end ( the output of the sound card or interface )and thats where the latency issues arise. You are not recording with effects, but you can add them to the input signal so that it is not dry during your recording takes.

I had a discussion with a good friend regarding this topic just the other day, Pat is a very knowledgeable guy, excellent all around musician and we both agreed that a package such as Sonar for under $500 is an excellent tool for a home studio which does not require the industry standard ( and cost) of Pro Tools. I have Sonar 7HS XL and am going to get Version 8 Producer. It just has way too much to offer and to grow into , I view this as a serious workstation where it has all the bells and whistles and when you need one or two, ( and you will ) they are there. For under $500 I doubt we can find a better total package for a small home studio. One very serious feature is V Vocal, which is the pitch correction tool, these plug-ins sell for a couple hundred by themselves. Fix one note or the whole track (one or two notes preferred) this is a tool well worth the cost if you plan on having any vocal tracks added to any projects. Do not scrub a great performance track because of one or two bad notes and certainly to not master a final track with one or two bad notes either.

just my take

tp

Jon Light (deceased) · Post by **Jon Light (deceased)** » 2 Jan 2009 8:36 am

Novice question-----

---if someone wants to send me tracks so I can lay down a steel track for him, do we need to have compatible programs/formats? Or is everything universal (eg. .wav files) and I just open them with any multitrack freeware, do my thing and send them back?

Is everything proprietary or is it all generic (format-wise)?

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 2 Jan 2009 11:19 am

You can send tracks in Wave or MP3 which make them compatible with all programs , some serious folks supply an FTP address to return the files rather than Email.

If you do send files though, send them dry , no effects raw EQ...

It's a easy as pie..

tp

Orville Johnson · Post by **Orville Johnson** » 2 Jan 2009 12:28 pm

You would want to use .wav files for a serious CD project. All the major recording softwares (ProTools, DP, Cubase, etc) will accept them. MP3 files are compressed and don't carry the full amount of information that you'd want to represent your sound.

Jon Light (deceased) · Post by **Jon Light (deceased)** » 2 Jan 2009 5:14 pm

Thanks Tony, Orville.
re: .wav vs. mp3----yes, that much I do know. Actually, whenever possible I do my general ipod mp3 conversions at the highest bitrate possible and get significantly better results than I would, otherwise, but still, for tracking I do understand that lossy conversions would be a huge mistake.

What I need to do is spend some time browsing online for a home recording for dumbasses primer (I am confident I will google up something). I don't want to hassle people for some of the basic info I'm fishing for.

What I can't understand at the moment is the nuts & bolts of what i would be sent, how I would format it or load it, how I would sync to it, what I would send back, sync'd, how? Mixed...how? Actually, the syncing thing is the gist of what I'm not getting a picture of.

....unless the music that I am sent (or that I download) is in multi-track form and I am simply laying down my tracks on empty tracks.....

If this is actually just as simple as the old days where I would be sent a partially tracked multi-track tape that I would put on my machine, well then all my questions go away but I'm believing that there's more to it than that.....

If someone would kind enough to tell me

--"yes, it basically is as simple as that analog multitrack tape analogy"

or

--"no, there a bunch more you need to understand"

then I'll take it from there.

Gracias.

Orville Johnson · Post by **Orville Johnson** » 2 Jan 2009 5:45 pm

there are a couple of ways you might receive the tracks. If it's in a format that you also use (let's say ProTools for sake of discussion) you'd get a folder with audio files and session data. This could be sent to you on a disc or transmitted over the internet by uploading it to an FTP server (I've used yousendit.com)and you downloading it to your computer. Then you would import the session into your Protools rig and it would open up as a ProTools session with all the tracks for you. you'd create some tracks for your part, record, and send it back.

If you don't have a matching program, instead of sending you all the individual tracks the person might send you a stereo .wav file with a mix of what you're overdubbing to. you would import that into whatever program you're using, create some tracks for your part, and make sure your completed tracks are continuous files that start at zero.

What I mean by that is, for instance, if you played 3 or 4 tracks and then comped a part together that would be your completed track, you should then make the various parts into one solid audio file (different programs call this process by different names, render, consolidate, etc) that starts at the zero marking of the track. This takes care of the syncing up thing because your new track should import back into their program at zero, putting it in sync with the rest of their tracks.

So, it's almost as simple as taking the tape and throwing it on the machine, but not exactly! sorry for the long post and I don't know if I've explained it well enough but there's my ten cents worth!

Jon Light (deceased) · Post by **Jon Light (deceased)** » 2 Jan 2009 6:03 pm

Ah. That was great. I've got a hugely better idea of all this now. Actual discreet tracks if we have matching formats. Just laying down my tracks to a rough mix otherwise. Syncing it all up with a zero'd out counter.
Bada bing...
Thanks a bunch for that.

And the digital format automatically makes my playing great too, or so I understand.....what a country.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 3 Jan 2009 2:22 am

I just did a Steel track for a Sonar guy, he sent me a rough stereo mix by email (wave)of the tune minus everything but drums, vocal , bass and simple acoustic. He asked me to wail away. Seeing it was more of a sad ballad and more towards a Pop/Americana style, there was not much call for wailing , and it certainly was not a Country tune.

I opened my Sonar, inserted his wave track, added a few audio tracks and recorded the Steel over two tracks with a few options for him. I saved the whole thing as a cakewalk project file (*.cwp) then uploaded it to an FTP address he sent me. The project files are real big so email was out of the question. I could have deleted his wave track from the project I suppose as all he was going to do is take my two tracks from the project file and place them into his project.

This format that Orville mentions above is really quite efficient. Easy as pie, except for the playing part..

The only thing wrong with this E-method is that even though he asked me to play what I felt was appropriate, it may not have matched what HE wanted, it's his song and his track. He should have sent me two files, one with the fills and such and one without so that I could see what direction he was going in. When in the studio, the producers describe the scenario and we play something along those lines and before we leave everyone is happy (we hope) . Thats whats missing with the E-sessions, immediate feedback and coaching.

Next time I will request a basic track and a track with fills and solo's if they have one.

tp

Earnest Bovine · Post by **Earnest Bovine** » 3 Jan 2009 9:19 am

Gary,
Many audio interfaces come with free starter versions of both Sonar and Cubase, so you will probably be able to compare them before you have to spend any more money. "LE" is the free version of Cubase. I found Cubase LE to be easy to use, and it includes so many features that I don't think I'll ever have to buy the bigger version.

gary pierce · Post by **gary pierce** » 4 Jan 2009 6:06 pm

Thanks again for all the post. I'm learning more all the time. I finished my wiring, insulation, and sheet rock and now need to either mud it or use a different wall finish. I think I'll use a locking type floating floor also.